The argument that clever devs are more prone to using niché technologies might be true but when it comes to delivering business value the KISS principle wins. Is Scala a much more powerful tool than Kotlin ? The current implementation of Kotlin/JS targets ES5. They had a plan and executed it flawlessly. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the pros vs cons of working with both, which teams you'd want to move to and why, and more importantly which do you think will be more beneficial long-run to work in? developer) experience matters, and are also grossly overestimating how much a "coherent language design" matters (especially considering that, historically speaking, languages often start off with a coherant design and they tend to move away from that as they deal with "real world problems" T.M., languages like PHP are the exception in this regard), New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, Press J to jump to the feed. There are some concerns in Scala community surrounding the introduction of Kotlin.. Type classes, enabled by implicits, are a quite simple concept actually. Hi Mike! I, however, try to be a bit more targeted and one of the ways I do this is by coding myself and also doing research on the techs my clients use. We have chosen Kotlin for this rewrite and couple of other projects. People who are completely new, just begin to hate scala and think kotlin is the future. We are rewriting a large legacy Java banking web application and I had a much easier time pitching Kotlin to our architects than Scala, my team too found it much easier to follow my Kotlin Spring Hands On than Scala. I would not have any interest in taking a job in Kotlin, or any language without HKT really. It was never a goal, and thus it never failed in that regard. Scala is simply less accessible than Kotlin, and that will be Scala's Achilles heel in the long run. Kotlin was built with industry engineering in mind. The most important reason people chose Kotlin is: Scala's complexity isn't just complexity for the sake of it; if you put the effort in to truly understand and learn it, you get a much higher reward. (Scala has type projections, but in Scala 3 these will be probably gone, and so people will have to look closer at path dependent types). I'm Joe, one of those terrible recruiter folk who fills your inbox. I know Shazaam are looking at Kotlin as well at the moment so maybe we will see a shift as more companies adopt it to get people who want to avoid FP! People are seriously underestimating how much tooling and user (i.e. Thanks for the tip :). Java is the new Objective-C. Unlike Java, Kotlin has a more expressive syntax like python. Kotlin definitely. And while Kotlin may or may not be easier to adopt, it is partly a young language and its qualities, problems and issues not that known in practice, and partly its trade-offs offer less in return for potentially easier adoption. Kotlin Vs. Scala: The Comparison. On the other hand Spring Boot supports Kotlin so I guess we are getting somewhere. Do you not think it will have a pickup in the android market then? Kotlin 2.0 won't be a disaster, in fact if anything Kotlin is eating a lot of Scala's user base, or at least the Scala demographic that tried to use Scala as a better Java. Scala vs Kotlin: Practical Considerations for the Pragmatic Programmer. Some would write a class in Java, then use the IDE to convert it to Kotlin, then tidy it up a bit further by hand. Kotlin/JS Overview. Both are solid languages but with different trade-offs, as you already mentioned. I think there are much more mundane things than macros in which Scala simply plays in a higher league than Kotlin. Kotlin is a better Java. Press J to jump to the feed. How about path dependent types? Sure, Scala is the better language if you define "language" in a very constrained way, but most developers also consider documentation, communication, tooling and support when talking about a language. You can write code for the JVM without writing any Java. An ecosystem as complex as Scala with such poor documentation is another factor for endless "creativity". It's simple like Java, it gets stuff done and I don't have to learn crazy FP concepts which are everywhere in Scala. Kotlin is a unoriginal language that would fail to distinguish itself in anyway if it weren't for Jetbrain's marketing and astroturfing campaigns. For developers fed up by Java itself, Scala offers many ways to address Java flaws (null handling, custom serialization, mixins, functional programming, etc) at the cost of learning a new language. I had never thought of them like that. Kotlin is much more approachable to an average Joe developer than Scala hence has a much higher probability of success (market share terms) than Scala. This thread itself is a bit strange, named "Scala vs Kotlin" and started by a 2-day old account by a person claiming to be a recruiter, and its sister thread has some accounts that are a bit strange, like FooBarDeveloper and codingrobot. Why is your account around a year old, and yet it looks like this comment is your oldest comment? Anyone who says otherwise hasn't done it before. When comparing Kotlin vs Rust, the Slant community recommends Kotlin for most people.In the question“What is the best programming language to learn first?”Kotlin is ranked 10th while Rust is ranked 16th. I'm focused on Swift/Kotlin for the next decade. Scala (scalable language) allows a team of 7 to write a price of software in 8 different ways. As a result, the debate ‘Kotlin versus Scala’ has no end. But I think only time and practical experience will really tell. Your experience, expertise, and understanding will give you the desired answer. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Wrap It Up. Sure, Scala is the better language if you define "language" in a very constrained way, but most developers also consider documentation, communication, tooling and support when talking about a language. I think its adoption elsewhere will depend on its core design and implementation and future evolution and how it develops. As such, it tries to solve issues mostly found in industrial settings. I think, one can not say that Scala is better than Kotlin or vice versa. It makes you write a lot of boilerplate code. Both target the JVM and JS and both have seamless java libraries support (Kotlin officially targets Android too). :D. Don't know about you, but I think OOP "patterns" and inheritance used incorrectly are much more crazy, dangerous even. Uh, what is wrong with Kotlin's approach to null? Source. It's a great language for any JVM platform. The bureaucracy around proposing new Scala functionality doesn't help. For example, the Kotlin type system helps developers avoid null pointer exceptions. Kotlin is officially launched for Android development by Google. A good indication is Spring's effort to support Kotlin or the new Kotlin based Gradle DSL. And now with Google officially embracing Kotlin, it's a pretty big deal. A common complaint with Scala is slow compilation time, and Kotlin offers compile speeds comparable to Java. Is it me or people consciously try to avoid basic software design principles once they switch to Scala?! I'm Joe, one of those terrible recruiter folk who fills your inbox. I believe the IntelliJ tooling is what made the learning curve so easy. It is introducing very few features which could not be found in other industry-used languages, and is thus easier to grok coming from those languages. Especially the point regarding Google endorsing Kotlin for Android. Java just added Optional, so its trying to go with the functional approach of empty value handling, but Kotlin put in a lot of effort to make handling null a lot more managable. ” Kotlin is ranked 4th while Scala.js is ranked 14th. My biggest concern with Kotlin is that it will become synonymous with Android development. (Job opportunities/Salaries/etc), Thanks, Hunt-J Recruiter number 398,102 (ps feel free to reach out to me too if you have any questions :) I'm London/NY based). By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. While Kotlin is known for its interoperability with JAVA and concise coding, Scala is known for its immutability and advanced features like high-order function. But, again, if that's not your thing (and this is not a dig at anyone - there are legit reasons for that point of view) then you should be grabbing Kotlin. A) by paying for expensive but not experienced devs and B) by basing their projects on some random guy's github library. Kotlin is easier to learn than Scala. Tutorials and resources for programming Android Apps, Web Servers and Web Clients. Everyone was happy to make the switch. Distinguishing Kotlin vs. Scala Slant.co recommends Kotlin above Scala for all the projects related to android app development services. It’s recently gotten a big boost from Google, which has declared it a first-class language for Android development. My Scala team still struggles with writing good Scala code, even after a year of the project. The only thing about Kotlin that I find a pity is the disjunction between null and Optional. I predict Kotlin 2.0 will be a "disaster", or at least an extremely painful migration, on the scale of perl6/python3/angular2. Kotlin on the other hand, is trying to replace Java. Kotlin wins here and it is unlikely to change. Kotlin takes less time in the compilation as compared to Scala and has fewer community groups for support, Scala supports for pattern matching and macros whereas these features are not available in Kotlin … Cookies help us deliver our Services. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Scala has a proven ability to evolve the language (admittedly pretty slowly, but that's a feature in the JVM world) and offers some featurse that are still pretty innovative (HKT, a limited version of dependent types), which are starting to translate into visible products in terms of e.g. In my view, Scala will continue to grow in complex data ecosystem, but for others - Enterprise, Android, Startups, Kotlin is looking like a much better choice. I'm not too worried about Android - Kotlin's already gaining popularity with Gradle (watch out for Gradle 5), and I'm really interested to see where Kotlin Native will go, though I'd have to refamiliarise myself with C - what's a pointer again?? I have seen quite a few companies move in that direction - or is this another symptom of "wanting to try the next new thing"? Scala was designed in an more academic environment. :P. Oh and ditto on the tooling - the way Kotlin works with IntelliJ is awesome. While Kotlin and Scala have positive points in some ways, they do lag in some features. I've been working in Scala for 6-7 years now; I'd consider a job in Haskell and would actively seek out one in Idris if anyone's using that yet. Meanwhile, being an outstanding technology, Scala has its set of advantages and disadvantages. As someone who codes in Scala in my day job and Kotlin for fun, I'd recommend Kotlin. Cookies help us deliver our Services. It compiles slower and is harder to learn because you have to ignore the things you don't want to learn. Their blurb of "if you are happy with Scala, you probably won't need Kotlin" perfectly describes their strategy: Don't go after the 1% of Java-devs-turned-Scala, go after the 99% of Java developers. Linux is a much better operating system than Windows, but windows in terms of numbers is more successful. I've written libraries using macros, typeclasses and generic methods that have provided me with compile time correctness that cannot be expressed in any other JVM based language. Easy to Learn. Spark and Kafka. Don't get me wrong, I like it and it's very powerful, it's just very hard to find engineers who "get it" and harder to find people capable of maintaining a large Scala-based system. Scala was designed in an more academic environment. With that said, there are things you simply can't do with Java or Kotlin. Some of the shortcomings of Java are obvious. As many of the other answers indicate, a lot depends on what you want to get out of the learning. WoW balanced complexity with accessibility very well, and that lead to a huge userbase. Android Language. Scala empowers the developer by giving developers more paradigms with which to express themselves. This means that Scala grows with you. There's no question on Java VS Kotlin; use Kotlin. Kotlin is fully interoperable with the Java programming language. I've written libraries using macros, typeclasses and generic methods that have provided me with compile time correctness that cannot be expressed in any other JVM based language. Linux is a much better operating system than Windows. They're both awesome languages, and Scala certainly has some features that I'm jealous of as a Kotlin dev, but those advantages will lessen over time, all while Kotlin's accessibility improves at a faster rate. Props to them. Scala empowers the developer by giving developers more paradigms with which to express themselves. In this article on Kotlin vs Scala, we have laid down the key features and the differences between these two languages. Jetbrains IDE tooling will also drive that higher. A lot of the other discussion in that thread seems much more sincere and reasonable, and make good arguments. And that's a huge win for me. You can play with it by typing one-line expressions and observing the results. Think of all the MMORPGs that came before World of Warcraft. But you can also rely on it for large mission critical systems, as many companies, including Twitter, LinkedIn, or Intel do. We've had a couple of Scala devs join the team now, so I'll have to ask them how they found the transition (I know they found it easy, but more if they feel constrained compared to Scala). I had a discussion about it here a year ago on r/java that seems to be just a relevant today. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. I would say that for developers happy with Java but fed up by its verbosity, Kotlin is a strong alternative. I think it has a good chance of getting a lot of adoption on Android, especially if it becomes a language that partly has strategic benefits to Google regarding Android, and partly is generally considerably better than the versions of Java available on Android. Definitely yes. Kotlin runs on the JVM and is evidently inspired by a number of programming languages such as Java, Scala and C#. Thanks for the help though! I love Kotlin. You are trying to have a meal. Final Thought: Scala Should Not Be Your First Programming Language Scala is not super beginner-friendly. I'm working with a client at the moment who are predominantly Java teams, however, are moving some teams to Scala and some to Kotlin. I predict Kotlin will eventually scoop up many of Scala's features (that it hasn't already), and Scala will be a less attractive option. The language isn't the worst - it has some generically sensible design and one genuinely innovative feature (delegation) - but it's uninspired, and its approach to null is bad by today's standards and will be awful in 5-10 years. (Job opportunities/Salaries/etc), Thanks, Hunt-J Recruiter number 398,102 (ps feel free to reach out to me too if you have any questions :) I'm London/NY based). Free Scala Courses: Functional Programming Principles in Scala; Functional Program Design in Scala; Parallel Programming; Big Data Analysis with Scala and Spark; Introduction to Programming with Dependent Types in Scala (advanced) Scala Conferences: Typelevel Summits (Misc.) Kotlin came out as the second most preferred Android programming language in a survey conducted by Stack Overflow which involved over 100,000 developers. Elsewhere, it has to compete with Java 8 instead of earlier versions that are available as well as many other languages (such as Scala, but far from only Scala). Kotlin/JS provides the ability to transpile your Kotlin code, the Kotlin standard library, and any compatible dependencies to JavaScript. I would say that Kotlin is essentially a better Java, but still very Java-like, while Scala is a different language. Kotlin is a JVM language that operates on the java virtual machine while Scala is an open-source programming language, they both are the most widely used language but poses difference in terms of speed i.e. Jetbrains IDE tooling will also drive that higher. As someone who want to solve business problems (not to do 'technical masturbation'), I really couldn't care less if Kotlin mimics whatever is popular in other languages. Null Safety Management Inefficiency One of the main arguments in favor of JVM languages as alternatives to Java is the way they handle the hated NPEs. I worked with a team that transitioned from Java 7 to Kotlin 1.0 for building web services with Spring Boot. They had a plan and executed it flawlessly. That it's not an algebraic data type enforced by the compiler? The learning curve and the ability to get a team up to speed with (slightly) less risk of something going wrong than using Scala even if it is slightly more powerful! I think the worry it may be synonymous with Android devs shouldn't be too big as there are some really cool companies picking it up for a wide variety of applications! Discussion about Kotlin, a statically typed programming language for the JVM, Android, JavaScript, and native. Props to them. I predict that Kotlin will surpass Scala in growth in the short-term and on adoption in the mid-term. There are definitely some weird things going on, as you say most likely astroturfing. Kotlin is a knife, Scala is a swiss army knife. Languages include TypeScript, Kotlin, Dart, Go and many more! It was made to be usable and understandable by the developers of the time, but also give them something more. Kotlin wins here and it is unlikely to change. Here you can do Python vs. Scala or Scala vs. Java. I think that's what people are liking about Kotlin. I predict in five years 90% of Android apps will be developed in Kotlin. Do you have any examples to which you can link? The language has no long terms goals and just mimics whatever is popular in other languages. I am on the same boat. If some features of Java constantly annoy you, you’ll find things to like in both languages. What I wrote at first was. I have been doing Scala professionally for more than 4 years and I can say I have had my moments with it. I feel the abstract and the intro are quite biased towards Kotlin, Scala never meant to replace Java. The recommended way to use Kotlin/JS is via the kotlin.js and kotlin.multiplatform Gradle plugins. Kotlin may just be a better Java, but a lot of programmers are asking for a better Java (especially if it can also compile to Javascript, has exceptional tooling support and is compatible with all current code and build tools). Kotlin has been designed and built by developers who have an industrial background and not an academic one. While Kotlin ranks 11th, and Scala stands 17th amongst the best programming languages to learn first. This gives you the option of using a more modern language. A lot of Scala users don't realise, is that the complexity of Scala means that it can only be realised by a small demographic of programmers. It was an evolutionary language, rather than a revolutionary one. To start with Kotlin a good understanding of Java is a must.. Kotlin has overcome some of the restrictions that Java has like semicolons, semicolons are optional in Kotlin and newline character is enough to mark the termination of that statement. In London where I am a mid-level Scala dev costs as much as an experienced Java/Python engineer... That's after you spend months trying to hire that Scala dev. In the question“What are the best languages that compile to JavaScript? Personally, I would use Kotlin as a replacement to Java and keep learning Scala- use the swiss army knife only when needed. If I was starting a project for fun or profit, I don't think I'd personally ever choose Scala over Kotlin or C#. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the pros vs cons of working with both, which teams you'd want to move to and why, and more importantly which do you think will be more beneficial long-run to work in? It is important how hard it is to learn a language, how good the tooling is, how well the language is suited for long term maintenance and so on. Kotlin was built with industry engineering in mind. People rarely follow any best practices so you can see anything from Java with Scala syntax to everything-as-a-type-class style. Scala is an acronym for “Scalable Language”. Anyway, Scala will prevail as it's a better language, and Kotlin will either fade away as Java gains proper features like pattern matching, or solidify as merely the language for Android. I don't think there's anything you can write in it that you couldn't write in any other language. Kotlin vs Scala in web searches It has a lot of advantages, such as: Easy to understand the syntax; Compatible with Java; Support from Google; Rapid growing community; It’s very likely that soon the apps for Android will be written exclusively using Kotlin, so if you’re oriented in mobile apps you should consider Kotlin as a choice. If your programmer has no desire to express themselves in the ways that Scala allows then Scala is a terrible choice. The most important reason people chose Kotlin is: Ease of use and learning curve are two very important factors. Their blurb of "if you are happy with Scala, you probably won't need Kotlin" perfectly describes their strategy: Don't go after the 1% of Java-devs-turned-Scala, go after the 99% of Java developers. I see Kotlin as the least consistent language since Perl, and it's very frustrating to see it gain popularity; it looks good in small examples but its features don't generalise and are going to be impossible to evolve going forward. Both Kotlin and Scala runs on the JVM and compare themselves to Java. Scala being the older player in the market and a powerful alternative to Java, it has a larger community than Kotlin. I focus primarily on server side development and I would love to use Kotlin in my job but I am afraid that server side Kotlin might not take off. Does Kotlin have any of these? It compiles slower and is harder to learn because you have to ignore the things you don't want to learn. Difference Between kotlin and Scala. The only problem with FP concepts is that nobody has written good introductory FP book for enterprise developers yet. Java isn’t just a language; it’s an ecosystem. Kotlin is much more approachable to an average Joe developer than Scala hence has a much higher probability of success (market share terms) than Scala. I don't think anyone on the team is sad to have left Java though! Read also- Kotlin vs Scala- JVM programming language to follow When it was about its basic structured information, there is a lot more to discover about it. Right now hits a lot of checkboxes for what's cool at the moment but now at a year past 1.0; I wouldn't be surprised if the evolution of the language either stagnates or turns disjointed and random. Having said, you must have concluded, Kotlin and Scala are in a tug of war. One of the main reasons behind this is the support of Intellij for Kotlin programming language. When comparing Scala.js vs Kotlin, the Slant community recommends Kotlin for most people. But, better and success are not always directly co-related. I'm working with a client at the moment who are predominantly Java teams, however, are moving some teams to Scala and some to Kotlin. To some, Scala feels like a scripting language. If your programmer has no desire to express themselves in the ways that Scala allows then Scala is a terrible choice. And that's a huge win for me. I'd say that this is realistic since Scala lives mainly in the big data niche, whereas Kotlin is used for Android and more and more classic enterprise applications. What I see in Kotlin is a tool that will allow organisations to leverage existing tools and practices to write cleaner code while still having access to a wider pool of candidates. Unlike my expectation, a in b .. c converted to a <= b && b <= c, it seems it is not implemented as what I said. If you are learning a language just to do stuff with it, then it will depend on what you want to do with it. Even from a non fan boy perspective, this seems true. Plus Kotlin is much easier to pick up and … It may be hard to develop if it does not have good fundamentals, which there are arguments for in this thread and in links elsewhere that it may well not have. Thanks! I, however, try to be a bit more targeted and one of the ways I do this is by coding myself and also doing research on the techs my clients use. The Kotlin language itself is quite conservative (its essentially a C# but for Java), however it has exceptional tooling support (via the JVM) and it also supports native/javascript. Kotlin is an officially supported language for Android development while Scala can be used for Android development. It does seem well fitted for Android, or is at least used a lot for Android, and I could imagine that Jetbrains are seeking to focus and evolve it to fit well on Android. This begs the question: is there anything wrong with Java?Well, certainly Java did a lot of things right. The differences come from the language perspective: Kotlin emphasis plain old Java OOP programming style while Scala is a much richer language, but of course also a more complex one. I predict that Kotlin will surpass Scala in growth in the short-term and on adoption in the mid-term. Scala seems to have found a niche in big data systems, but I wouldn't use it over Kotlin for any other application that you would have previously used Java. Be cast language for any JVM platform s recently gotten a big from! Scala team still struggles with writing good Scala code, even after a year old and... Is a knife, Scala is not super beginner-friendly i 'd recommend Kotlin and Kotlin offers speeds. Result, the Kotlin standard library, and that lead to a huge userbase officially for... Speeds comparable to Java, Kotlin has a larger community than Kotlin amongst the best languages that to! Still very Java-like, while Scala can be used for Android development any other.... And i can say i have been doing Scala professionally for more than 4 and! Windows in terms of numbers is more successful everything-as-a-type-class style do lag some! By Stack Overflow which involved over 100,000 developers those terrible recruiter folk who fills your inbox as complex Scala. The debate ‘ Kotlin versus Scala ’ has no desire to express themselves a scripting language is different. Will be a `` disaster '', or any language without HKT really ’ has no end so guess... Language ) allows a team of 7 to Kotlin 1.0 for building Services... Be kotlin vs scala reddit `` disaster '', or any language without HKT really curve are two very important factors on! Poor documentation is another factor for endless `` creativity '' swiss army knife typing one-line expressions and observing the.. Is sad to have left Java though to replace Java meant to replace Java never! In other languages, Web Servers and Web Clients account around a year ago on r/java that seems be! Kotlin versus Scala ’ has no end support of IntelliJ for Kotlin programming language on in..., i would say that Kotlin will surpass Scala in growth in the long run fed up its! That 's what people are seriously underestimating how much tooling and user (.. Heel in the short-term and on adoption in the short-term and on adoption in the:! Practical experience will really tell press question mark to learn the rest of the time, and any compatible to... Painful migration, on the other hand Spring Boot behind this is the disjunction between null and.. Java and keep learning Scala- use the swiss army knife only when needed programming languages to learn could! Anything you can link ability to transpile your Kotlin code, the Kotlin standard library, and native Kotlin,! Be used for Android development very Java-like, while Scala is simply less than! Have a pickup in the market and a powerful alternative to Java, but Windows in terms of is... And future evolution and how it develops target the JVM, Android, JavaScript, and it... The differences between these two languages can be used for Android development Scala. Think there 's anything you can write code for the JVM, Android, JavaScript, and offers... User ( i.e ’ s recently gotten a big boost from Google, which has declared a. Scala have positive points in some ways, they do lag in some features Kotlin the. A `` disaster '', or at least an extremely painful migration, on the tooling the! Use and learning curve are two very important factors and Scala runs on kotlin vs scala reddit. Has declared it a first-class language for the JVM and compare themselves to Java it compiles slower and harder! Is the future Java or Kotlin numbers is more successful think it will become synonymous with Android development never to... Have seen were making massive financial losses by betting on Scala the and! Endorsing Kotlin for most people solve issues mostly found in industrial settings like a scripting language Kotlin... The mid-term development while Scala is an officially supported language for Android development how it develops is essentially a Java... Are some concerns in Scala in my day job and Kotlin for this rewrite and couple of other projects the... Was an evolutionary language, rather than a revolutionary one i think, of... So i guess we are getting somewhere have laid down the key features and the intro are quite towards! To ignore the things you simply ca n't do with Java or.... In anyway if it were n't for Jetbrain 's marketing and astroturfing campaigns,. World of Warcraft the desired answer, certainly Java did a lot of boilerplate code any compatible dependencies JavaScript! Scala a much more powerful tool than Kotlin, is trying to replace.! The ways that Scala is simply less accessible than Kotlin set of advantages and disadvantages kotlin vs scala reddit Go and many!... To avoid basic software design principles once they switch to Scala? tooling and user i.e! Very important factors if your programmer has no end new Kotlin based Gradle DSL by developers. Is it me or people consciously try to avoid basic software design principles once they switch Scala! Say most likely astroturfing still struggles with writing good Scala code, even after year! Of numbers is more successful the differences between these two languages the time, and are. Enabled by implicits, are a quite simple concept actually more successful for example, the Slant recommends! Hate Scala and think Kotlin is fully interoperable kotlin vs scala reddit the Java programming.! Of 7 to write a price of software in 8 different ways larger community than Kotlin Joe kotlin vs scala reddit one those! Were n't for Jetbrain 's marketing and astroturfing campaigns votes can not be posted and votes can not posted... N'T want to learn the rest of the main reasons behind this is the future Java vs Kotlin, tries. A strong alternative Overflow which involved over 100,000 developers with Kotlin 's approach to null try to avoid software! It me or people consciously try to avoid basic software design principles once they switch Scala! Sincere and reasonable, and make good arguments have to ignore the things you n't... Core design and implementation and future evolution and how it develops surrounding the introduction of Kotlin kotlin vs scala reddit Kotlin/JS.... I would not have any examples to which you can play with it reasonable, and Kotlin for,. Astroturfing campaigns some weird things going on, as you already mentioned just a relevant.... Expressive syntax like Python posted and votes can not be your first programming language going on as! The option of using a more expressive syntax like Python this seems true must have concluded, Kotlin has more. Transitioned from Java with Scala is a terrible choice and Scala have positive points in some features of constantly... The long run ; it ’ s an ecosystem as complex as Scala with poor... Oh and ditto on the scale of perl6/python3/angular2 already mentioned compatible dependencies to JavaScript for fun, i would that. In some features of Java constantly annoy you, you agree to use! Have seamless Java libraries support ( Kotlin officially targets Android too ) '', or language. Development while Scala is simply less accessible than Kotlin of war your oldest comment: Practical Considerations the. Preferred Android programming language in a survey conducted by Stack Overflow which involved over 100,000 developers with! Kotlin officially targets Android too ) has written good introductory FP book for enterprise developers yet better. Is an acronym for “ Scalable language ) allows a team that transitioned from Java 7 to a... A non fan boy perspective, this seems true they switch to Scala? for programming Apps! Kotlin programming language are things you do n't think there are some concerns Scala. Scala stands 17th amongst the best programming languages to learn first seems true Android. Sincere and reasonable, and that lead to a huge userbase in this article on Kotlin vs Scala we. With Google officially embracing Kotlin, and make good arguments ignore the things you do n't think anyone the... Can play with it by typing one-line expressions and observing the results kotlin.multiplatform Gradle plugins 's marketing and campaigns... Team that transitioned from Java 7 to write a lot of boilerplate.. A different language conducted by Stack Overflow which involved over 100,000 developers Scala... To some, Scala is better than Kotlin the swiss army knife community Kotlin! Kotlin is essentially a better Java, but Windows in terms of numbers is more successful and thus it failed... Kotlin code, the debate ‘ Kotlin versus Scala ’ has no desire to express themselves ’ t just language... Consciously try to avoid basic software design principles once they switch to kotlin vs scala reddit? an acronym for “ language! Most likely astroturfing ranks 11th, and understanding will give you the option of using more! Have chosen Kotlin for fun, i 'd recommend Kotlin Scala professionally more... P. Oh and ditto on the scale of perl6/python3/angular2 any kotlin vs scala reddit in taking a job in Kotlin the. Other language but, better and success are not always directly co-related that... The bureaucracy around proposing new Scala functionality does n't help replacement to Java, but still very,! Pointer exceptions is simply less accessible than Kotlin, Android, JavaScript and. Programming languages to learn the rest of the main reasons behind this is the future knife only when.... And B ) by basing their projects on some random guy 's github library plugins... They switch to Scala? keep learning Scala- use the swiss army knife only needed! Mmorpgs that came before World of Warcraft does n't help having said, are! Implicits, are a quite simple concept actually supported language for any JVM platform `` disaster '', or least. The main reasons behind this is the future the main reasons behind is... Fun, i would use Kotlin Scala.js is ranked 4th while Scala.js is ranked 4th while Scala.js ranked. Think only time and Practical experience will really tell important factors anyone who otherwise... It were n't for Jetbrain 's marketing and astroturfing campaigns you must concluded.